Example of a bijection from the set of real numbers to a subset of irrationals












1












$begingroup$


I need an example of a bijection from the set of real numbers to a subset of the irrationals.
I tried something like
$f(x)=x+sqrt{2}$,
but where should I map $-sqrt{2}$?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$












  • $begingroup$
    There are problems with all numbers of the form $-sqrt 2 +r$, with $rin mathbb Q$.
    $endgroup$
    – Git Gud
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:18












  • $begingroup$
    Worse than that -- your function maps $mathbb R$ onto itself
    $endgroup$
    – MPW
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:20






  • 9




    $begingroup$
    Map the rationals to the odd non-zero multiples of $sqrt2$. Map the non-zero multiples of $sqrt 2$ to the even multiples of $sqrt 2$. Take the identity elsewhere.
    $endgroup$
    – David Mitra
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:23


















1












$begingroup$


I need an example of a bijection from the set of real numbers to a subset of the irrationals.
I tried something like
$f(x)=x+sqrt{2}$,
but where should I map $-sqrt{2}$?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$












  • $begingroup$
    There are problems with all numbers of the form $-sqrt 2 +r$, with $rin mathbb Q$.
    $endgroup$
    – Git Gud
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:18












  • $begingroup$
    Worse than that -- your function maps $mathbb R$ onto itself
    $endgroup$
    – MPW
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:20






  • 9




    $begingroup$
    Map the rationals to the odd non-zero multiples of $sqrt2$. Map the non-zero multiples of $sqrt 2$ to the even multiples of $sqrt 2$. Take the identity elsewhere.
    $endgroup$
    – David Mitra
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:23
















1












1








1





$begingroup$


I need an example of a bijection from the set of real numbers to a subset of the irrationals.
I tried something like
$f(x)=x+sqrt{2}$,
but where should I map $-sqrt{2}$?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$




I need an example of a bijection from the set of real numbers to a subset of the irrationals.
I tried something like
$f(x)=x+sqrt{2}$,
but where should I map $-sqrt{2}$?







functions






share|cite|improve this question















share|cite|improve this question













share|cite|improve this question




share|cite|improve this question








edited Jul 8 '14 at 18:10









Mathmo123

17.9k33166




17.9k33166










asked Jul 8 '14 at 17:16









user 160756user 160756

551




551












  • $begingroup$
    There are problems with all numbers of the form $-sqrt 2 +r$, with $rin mathbb Q$.
    $endgroup$
    – Git Gud
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:18












  • $begingroup$
    Worse than that -- your function maps $mathbb R$ onto itself
    $endgroup$
    – MPW
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:20






  • 9




    $begingroup$
    Map the rationals to the odd non-zero multiples of $sqrt2$. Map the non-zero multiples of $sqrt 2$ to the even multiples of $sqrt 2$. Take the identity elsewhere.
    $endgroup$
    – David Mitra
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:23




















  • $begingroup$
    There are problems with all numbers of the form $-sqrt 2 +r$, with $rin mathbb Q$.
    $endgroup$
    – Git Gud
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:18












  • $begingroup$
    Worse than that -- your function maps $mathbb R$ onto itself
    $endgroup$
    – MPW
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:20






  • 9




    $begingroup$
    Map the rationals to the odd non-zero multiples of $sqrt2$. Map the non-zero multiples of $sqrt 2$ to the even multiples of $sqrt 2$. Take the identity elsewhere.
    $endgroup$
    – David Mitra
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:23


















$begingroup$
There are problems with all numbers of the form $-sqrt 2 +r$, with $rin mathbb Q$.
$endgroup$
– Git Gud
Jul 8 '14 at 17:18






$begingroup$
There are problems with all numbers of the form $-sqrt 2 +r$, with $rin mathbb Q$.
$endgroup$
– Git Gud
Jul 8 '14 at 17:18














$begingroup$
Worse than that -- your function maps $mathbb R$ onto itself
$endgroup$
– MPW
Jul 8 '14 at 17:20




$begingroup$
Worse than that -- your function maps $mathbb R$ onto itself
$endgroup$
– MPW
Jul 8 '14 at 17:20




9




9




$begingroup$
Map the rationals to the odd non-zero multiples of $sqrt2$. Map the non-zero multiples of $sqrt 2$ to the even multiples of $sqrt 2$. Take the identity elsewhere.
$endgroup$
– David Mitra
Jul 8 '14 at 17:23






$begingroup$
Map the rationals to the odd non-zero multiples of $sqrt2$. Map the non-zero multiples of $sqrt 2$ to the even multiples of $sqrt 2$. Take the identity elsewhere.
$endgroup$
– David Mitra
Jul 8 '14 at 17:23












4 Answers
4






active

oldest

votes


















2












$begingroup$

Let $f(x) = dfrac{arctan x}{pi}$, so $f^{-1}(x) = tan pi x$. $f$ maps $mathbb{R}$ to $(-dfrac12,dfrac12)$.



$$g(x) = begin{cases}
x in mathbb{Q} & x + sqrt{5}\
x notin mathbb{Q} & x\
end{cases}$$



$$g^{-1}(x) = begin{cases}
x > 1 & x - sqrt{5}\
x le 1 & x\
end{cases}$$



So $g circ f$ maps from $mathbb{R}$ to a certain subset of the irrationals between $-dfrac12$ and $dfrac12 + sqrt{5}$, and $f^{-1} circ g^{-1}$ maps the inverse.






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    $gof$ is not onto!
    $endgroup$
    – Mohammad Khosravi
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:48










  • $begingroup$
    You are correct, but it doesn't have to be onto. The question asked for a bijective map from $mathbb{R}$ to an irrational subset of the reals.
    $endgroup$
    – NovaDenizen
    Jul 8 '14 at 17:50












  • $begingroup$
    Yeah! In this case, it is not interesting! :)
    $endgroup$
    – Mohammad Khosravi
    Jul 8 '14 at 18:04



















1












$begingroup$

Let $A_i = pi^i {mathbb Q}$ and $ A =cup_{ige0} A_i$. Then the map $h:{mathbb R}backslash{mathbb Q}rightarrow {mathbb R}$
$$
h(x) = left{
begin{array}{ll}
pi x & xin A \
x & x in B={mathbb R}backslash A\
end{array}
right.
$$
is a bijection.






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$





















    1












    $begingroup$

    Enumerate $Bbb Q$ as $q_n$ for $ninBbb N$. Now define,



    $$f(x)=begin{cases}e^{2n+1} & x=q_n\e^{2n} & x=e^n, ninBbb N\x&text{otherwise}end{cases}$$



    Key point here is that $e$ is transcendental, so $e^nnotinBbb Q$ for any $n>0$. You can effectively replace $e$ by any other number with this property. For example $pi,sqrt2^sqrt2$, Liouville number, and so on and so forth.






    share|cite|improve this answer











    $endgroup$













    • $begingroup$
      @David: $e$ is transcendental. So yes.
      $endgroup$
      – Asaf Karagila
      Jul 8 '14 at 18:00



















    0












    $begingroup$

    Consider $A$ = { $pi + n : n in Bbb N$}.
    Clearly $A$ is countable. ( Consider the bijection $n rightarrow pi + n$ , $forall n in Bbb N$).
    So elements of $A$ can be expressed as, $A = {a_k : k in Bbb N}$.
    And we also can have $Bbb Q = {b_k : k in Bbb N}$



    Now consider the bijection



    $phi : Bbb R rightarrow Bbb R - Bbb Q$ by,



    $phi(x) := a_{2k+1}$ if $ x = b_k , x in Bbb Q$.



    = $a_{2k}$ if $x = a_k , x in A$



    = $x$ if $x in Bbb R - (A cup Bbb Q)$



    The construction in my example can be seen as a very general bijection from a general uncountable set to a proper uncountable subset of it.






    share|cite|improve this answer











    $endgroup$













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      4 Answers
      4






      active

      oldest

      votes








      4 Answers
      4






      active

      oldest

      votes









      active

      oldest

      votes






      active

      oldest

      votes









      2












      $begingroup$

      Let $f(x) = dfrac{arctan x}{pi}$, so $f^{-1}(x) = tan pi x$. $f$ maps $mathbb{R}$ to $(-dfrac12,dfrac12)$.



      $$g(x) = begin{cases}
      x in mathbb{Q} & x + sqrt{5}\
      x notin mathbb{Q} & x\
      end{cases}$$



      $$g^{-1}(x) = begin{cases}
      x > 1 & x - sqrt{5}\
      x le 1 & x\
      end{cases}$$



      So $g circ f$ maps from $mathbb{R}$ to a certain subset of the irrationals between $-dfrac12$ and $dfrac12 + sqrt{5}$, and $f^{-1} circ g^{-1}$ maps the inverse.






      share|cite|improve this answer











      $endgroup$













      • $begingroup$
        $gof$ is not onto!
        $endgroup$
        – Mohammad Khosravi
        Jul 8 '14 at 17:48










      • $begingroup$
        You are correct, but it doesn't have to be onto. The question asked for a bijective map from $mathbb{R}$ to an irrational subset of the reals.
        $endgroup$
        – NovaDenizen
        Jul 8 '14 at 17:50












      • $begingroup$
        Yeah! In this case, it is not interesting! :)
        $endgroup$
        – Mohammad Khosravi
        Jul 8 '14 at 18:04
















      2












      $begingroup$

      Let $f(x) = dfrac{arctan x}{pi}$, so $f^{-1}(x) = tan pi x$. $f$ maps $mathbb{R}$ to $(-dfrac12,dfrac12)$.



      $$g(x) = begin{cases}
      x in mathbb{Q} & x + sqrt{5}\
      x notin mathbb{Q} & x\
      end{cases}$$



      $$g^{-1}(x) = begin{cases}
      x > 1 & x - sqrt{5}\
      x le 1 & x\
      end{cases}$$



      So $g circ f$ maps from $mathbb{R}$ to a certain subset of the irrationals between $-dfrac12$ and $dfrac12 + sqrt{5}$, and $f^{-1} circ g^{-1}$ maps the inverse.






      share|cite|improve this answer











      $endgroup$













      • $begingroup$
        $gof$ is not onto!
        $endgroup$
        – Mohammad Khosravi
        Jul 8 '14 at 17:48










      • $begingroup$
        You are correct, but it doesn't have to be onto. The question asked for a bijective map from $mathbb{R}$ to an irrational subset of the reals.
        $endgroup$
        – NovaDenizen
        Jul 8 '14 at 17:50












      • $begingroup$
        Yeah! In this case, it is not interesting! :)
        $endgroup$
        – Mohammad Khosravi
        Jul 8 '14 at 18:04














      2












      2








      2





      $begingroup$

      Let $f(x) = dfrac{arctan x}{pi}$, so $f^{-1}(x) = tan pi x$. $f$ maps $mathbb{R}$ to $(-dfrac12,dfrac12)$.



      $$g(x) = begin{cases}
      x in mathbb{Q} & x + sqrt{5}\
      x notin mathbb{Q} & x\
      end{cases}$$



      $$g^{-1}(x) = begin{cases}
      x > 1 & x - sqrt{5}\
      x le 1 & x\
      end{cases}$$



      So $g circ f$ maps from $mathbb{R}$ to a certain subset of the irrationals between $-dfrac12$ and $dfrac12 + sqrt{5}$, and $f^{-1} circ g^{-1}$ maps the inverse.






      share|cite|improve this answer











      $endgroup$



      Let $f(x) = dfrac{arctan x}{pi}$, so $f^{-1}(x) = tan pi x$. $f$ maps $mathbb{R}$ to $(-dfrac12,dfrac12)$.



      $$g(x) = begin{cases}
      x in mathbb{Q} & x + sqrt{5}\
      x notin mathbb{Q} & x\
      end{cases}$$



      $$g^{-1}(x) = begin{cases}
      x > 1 & x - sqrt{5}\
      x le 1 & x\
      end{cases}$$



      So $g circ f$ maps from $mathbb{R}$ to a certain subset of the irrationals between $-dfrac12$ and $dfrac12 + sqrt{5}$, and $f^{-1} circ g^{-1}$ maps the inverse.







      share|cite|improve this answer














      share|cite|improve this answer



      share|cite|improve this answer








      edited Jul 8 '14 at 17:46

























      answered Jul 8 '14 at 17:39









      NovaDenizenNovaDenizen

      3,437718




      3,437718












      • $begingroup$
        $gof$ is not onto!
        $endgroup$
        – Mohammad Khosravi
        Jul 8 '14 at 17:48










      • $begingroup$
        You are correct, but it doesn't have to be onto. The question asked for a bijective map from $mathbb{R}$ to an irrational subset of the reals.
        $endgroup$
        – NovaDenizen
        Jul 8 '14 at 17:50












      • $begingroup$
        Yeah! In this case, it is not interesting! :)
        $endgroup$
        – Mohammad Khosravi
        Jul 8 '14 at 18:04


















      • $begingroup$
        $gof$ is not onto!
        $endgroup$
        – Mohammad Khosravi
        Jul 8 '14 at 17:48










      • $begingroup$
        You are correct, but it doesn't have to be onto. The question asked for a bijective map from $mathbb{R}$ to an irrational subset of the reals.
        $endgroup$
        – NovaDenizen
        Jul 8 '14 at 17:50












      • $begingroup$
        Yeah! In this case, it is not interesting! :)
        $endgroup$
        – Mohammad Khosravi
        Jul 8 '14 at 18:04
















      $begingroup$
      $gof$ is not onto!
      $endgroup$
      – Mohammad Khosravi
      Jul 8 '14 at 17:48




      $begingroup$
      $gof$ is not onto!
      $endgroup$
      – Mohammad Khosravi
      Jul 8 '14 at 17:48












      $begingroup$
      You are correct, but it doesn't have to be onto. The question asked for a bijective map from $mathbb{R}$ to an irrational subset of the reals.
      $endgroup$
      – NovaDenizen
      Jul 8 '14 at 17:50






      $begingroup$
      You are correct, but it doesn't have to be onto. The question asked for a bijective map from $mathbb{R}$ to an irrational subset of the reals.
      $endgroup$
      – NovaDenizen
      Jul 8 '14 at 17:50














      $begingroup$
      Yeah! In this case, it is not interesting! :)
      $endgroup$
      – Mohammad Khosravi
      Jul 8 '14 at 18:04




      $begingroup$
      Yeah! In this case, it is not interesting! :)
      $endgroup$
      – Mohammad Khosravi
      Jul 8 '14 at 18:04











      1












      $begingroup$

      Let $A_i = pi^i {mathbb Q}$ and $ A =cup_{ige0} A_i$. Then the map $h:{mathbb R}backslash{mathbb Q}rightarrow {mathbb R}$
      $$
      h(x) = left{
      begin{array}{ll}
      pi x & xin A \
      x & x in B={mathbb R}backslash A\
      end{array}
      right.
      $$
      is a bijection.






      share|cite|improve this answer











      $endgroup$


















        1












        $begingroup$

        Let $A_i = pi^i {mathbb Q}$ and $ A =cup_{ige0} A_i$. Then the map $h:{mathbb R}backslash{mathbb Q}rightarrow {mathbb R}$
        $$
        h(x) = left{
        begin{array}{ll}
        pi x & xin A \
        x & x in B={mathbb R}backslash A\
        end{array}
        right.
        $$
        is a bijection.






        share|cite|improve this answer











        $endgroup$
















          1












          1








          1





          $begingroup$

          Let $A_i = pi^i {mathbb Q}$ and $ A =cup_{ige0} A_i$. Then the map $h:{mathbb R}backslash{mathbb Q}rightarrow {mathbb R}$
          $$
          h(x) = left{
          begin{array}{ll}
          pi x & xin A \
          x & x in B={mathbb R}backslash A\
          end{array}
          right.
          $$
          is a bijection.






          share|cite|improve this answer











          $endgroup$



          Let $A_i = pi^i {mathbb Q}$ and $ A =cup_{ige0} A_i$. Then the map $h:{mathbb R}backslash{mathbb Q}rightarrow {mathbb R}$
          $$
          h(x) = left{
          begin{array}{ll}
          pi x & xin A \
          x & x in B={mathbb R}backslash A\
          end{array}
          right.
          $$
          is a bijection.







          share|cite|improve this answer














          share|cite|improve this answer



          share|cite|improve this answer








          edited Jul 8 '14 at 17:49

























          answered Jul 8 '14 at 17:41









          Mohammad KhosraviMohammad Khosravi

          2,014716




          2,014716























              1












              $begingroup$

              Enumerate $Bbb Q$ as $q_n$ for $ninBbb N$. Now define,



              $$f(x)=begin{cases}e^{2n+1} & x=q_n\e^{2n} & x=e^n, ninBbb N\x&text{otherwise}end{cases}$$



              Key point here is that $e$ is transcendental, so $e^nnotinBbb Q$ for any $n>0$. You can effectively replace $e$ by any other number with this property. For example $pi,sqrt2^sqrt2$, Liouville number, and so on and so forth.






              share|cite|improve this answer











              $endgroup$













              • $begingroup$
                @David: $e$ is transcendental. So yes.
                $endgroup$
                – Asaf Karagila
                Jul 8 '14 at 18:00
















              1












              $begingroup$

              Enumerate $Bbb Q$ as $q_n$ for $ninBbb N$. Now define,



              $$f(x)=begin{cases}e^{2n+1} & x=q_n\e^{2n} & x=e^n, ninBbb N\x&text{otherwise}end{cases}$$



              Key point here is that $e$ is transcendental, so $e^nnotinBbb Q$ for any $n>0$. You can effectively replace $e$ by any other number with this property. For example $pi,sqrt2^sqrt2$, Liouville number, and so on and so forth.






              share|cite|improve this answer











              $endgroup$













              • $begingroup$
                @David: $e$ is transcendental. So yes.
                $endgroup$
                – Asaf Karagila
                Jul 8 '14 at 18:00














              1












              1








              1





              $begingroup$

              Enumerate $Bbb Q$ as $q_n$ for $ninBbb N$. Now define,



              $$f(x)=begin{cases}e^{2n+1} & x=q_n\e^{2n} & x=e^n, ninBbb N\x&text{otherwise}end{cases}$$



              Key point here is that $e$ is transcendental, so $e^nnotinBbb Q$ for any $n>0$. You can effectively replace $e$ by any other number with this property. For example $pi,sqrt2^sqrt2$, Liouville number, and so on and so forth.






              share|cite|improve this answer











              $endgroup$



              Enumerate $Bbb Q$ as $q_n$ for $ninBbb N$. Now define,



              $$f(x)=begin{cases}e^{2n+1} & x=q_n\e^{2n} & x=e^n, ninBbb N\x&text{otherwise}end{cases}$$



              Key point here is that $e$ is transcendental, so $e^nnotinBbb Q$ for any $n>0$. You can effectively replace $e$ by any other number with this property. For example $pi,sqrt2^sqrt2$, Liouville number, and so on and so forth.







              share|cite|improve this answer














              share|cite|improve this answer



              share|cite|improve this answer








              edited Jul 8 '14 at 18:03

























              answered Jul 8 '14 at 17:47









              Asaf KaragilaAsaf Karagila

              306k33438769




              306k33438769












              • $begingroup$
                @David: $e$ is transcendental. So yes.
                $endgroup$
                – Asaf Karagila
                Jul 8 '14 at 18:00


















              • $begingroup$
                @David: $e$ is transcendental. So yes.
                $endgroup$
                – Asaf Karagila
                Jul 8 '14 at 18:00
















              $begingroup$
              @David: $e$ is transcendental. So yes.
              $endgroup$
              – Asaf Karagila
              Jul 8 '14 at 18:00




              $begingroup$
              @David: $e$ is transcendental. So yes.
              $endgroup$
              – Asaf Karagila
              Jul 8 '14 at 18:00











              0












              $begingroup$

              Consider $A$ = { $pi + n : n in Bbb N$}.
              Clearly $A$ is countable. ( Consider the bijection $n rightarrow pi + n$ , $forall n in Bbb N$).
              So elements of $A$ can be expressed as, $A = {a_k : k in Bbb N}$.
              And we also can have $Bbb Q = {b_k : k in Bbb N}$



              Now consider the bijection



              $phi : Bbb R rightarrow Bbb R - Bbb Q$ by,



              $phi(x) := a_{2k+1}$ if $ x = b_k , x in Bbb Q$.



              = $a_{2k}$ if $x = a_k , x in A$



              = $x$ if $x in Bbb R - (A cup Bbb Q)$



              The construction in my example can be seen as a very general bijection from a general uncountable set to a proper uncountable subset of it.






              share|cite|improve this answer











              $endgroup$


















                0












                $begingroup$

                Consider $A$ = { $pi + n : n in Bbb N$}.
                Clearly $A$ is countable. ( Consider the bijection $n rightarrow pi + n$ , $forall n in Bbb N$).
                So elements of $A$ can be expressed as, $A = {a_k : k in Bbb N}$.
                And we also can have $Bbb Q = {b_k : k in Bbb N}$



                Now consider the bijection



                $phi : Bbb R rightarrow Bbb R - Bbb Q$ by,



                $phi(x) := a_{2k+1}$ if $ x = b_k , x in Bbb Q$.



                = $a_{2k}$ if $x = a_k , x in A$



                = $x$ if $x in Bbb R - (A cup Bbb Q)$



                The construction in my example can be seen as a very general bijection from a general uncountable set to a proper uncountable subset of it.






                share|cite|improve this answer











                $endgroup$
















                  0












                  0








                  0





                  $begingroup$

                  Consider $A$ = { $pi + n : n in Bbb N$}.
                  Clearly $A$ is countable. ( Consider the bijection $n rightarrow pi + n$ , $forall n in Bbb N$).
                  So elements of $A$ can be expressed as, $A = {a_k : k in Bbb N}$.
                  And we also can have $Bbb Q = {b_k : k in Bbb N}$



                  Now consider the bijection



                  $phi : Bbb R rightarrow Bbb R - Bbb Q$ by,



                  $phi(x) := a_{2k+1}$ if $ x = b_k , x in Bbb Q$.



                  = $a_{2k}$ if $x = a_k , x in A$



                  = $x$ if $x in Bbb R - (A cup Bbb Q)$



                  The construction in my example can be seen as a very general bijection from a general uncountable set to a proper uncountable subset of it.






                  share|cite|improve this answer











                  $endgroup$



                  Consider $A$ = { $pi + n : n in Bbb N$}.
                  Clearly $A$ is countable. ( Consider the bijection $n rightarrow pi + n$ , $forall n in Bbb N$).
                  So elements of $A$ can be expressed as, $A = {a_k : k in Bbb N}$.
                  And we also can have $Bbb Q = {b_k : k in Bbb N}$



                  Now consider the bijection



                  $phi : Bbb R rightarrow Bbb R - Bbb Q$ by,



                  $phi(x) := a_{2k+1}$ if $ x = b_k , x in Bbb Q$.



                  = $a_{2k}$ if $x = a_k , x in A$



                  = $x$ if $x in Bbb R - (A cup Bbb Q)$



                  The construction in my example can be seen as a very general bijection from a general uncountable set to a proper uncountable subset of it.







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                  edited Jan 22 at 13:20

























                  answered May 6 '17 at 15:41









                  CoherentCoherent

                  1,147623




                  1,147623






























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